2012 Ford Fusion - VERY intermittent no start

Hoping to tap into the big brains around here for some ideas. :silly: I've had this vehicle two months, and it's acted up ONCE.

'12 Fusion 3.0L. Owner filled up the tank, drove it ten miles, parked it at home. Next morning, stubborn crank no start. Tows it to my shop. Starts on the first try. :lol: Runs, drives, everything is golden. No relevant codes anywhere. Nothing in the PCM. Codes haven't been cleared in 7000+ miles. All monitors completed. No permanent codes.

Had it rigged up in my flat stall for four days with a fuel pressure gauge, headlamp on the FPDM power/ground, and headlamp on the fuel pump power/ground. Never had a problem. Bleed down rate is always acceptable. Fuel quality is good. No E85. For anyone wondering, this IS a FPDM system, but there is no fuel rail pressure sensor.

Put it outside, drove it here and there, still no problems. Customer decides to pick up the vehicle, and guess what? Won't start when he gets to it. My service advisor tries to start it, same thing. Service advisor grabs me, and it immediately starts. Customer is standing right there, and we're both mystified. Might have been 90 seconds between the service advisor attempting to start it, and me starting it. Still no codes.

I've confirmed the purge isn't stuck open, or sticking intermittently, as far as I can tell. There is no parasitic drain or starting system concern. At one point, I let the vehicle sit for a week straight just to see what would happen. Fired up the first time.

The customer has been remarkably patient during this whole process. He understands that we can't diagnose an issue that isn't happening. But, he also feels like he can't rely on the vehicle anymore, and really doesn't want it back until it's fixed. I just got done putting four gallons in the tank, driving it and parking it. Trying to emulate how this whole thing started. We'll see what happens tomorrow.

I'd love to hear whatever theories, observations, suggestions, or WAGs you have to offer. Of course, there are no silver bullets for vehicles like this. But I've always found it valuable to bounce ideas off others when my testing isn't going anywhere.

Thanks for your time!

One fellow i help on the board here had a similar issue and it was the starter going out. May want to check connections at starter and grounds for it. Otherwise look for damaged wires going back to ignition and park neutral switch.

Have taken a fuel pump waveform?

Hardtopdr2 wrote: One fellow i help on the board here had a similar issue and it was the starter going out. May want to check connections at starter and grounds for it. Otherwise look for damaged wires going back to ignition and park neutral switch.

Do you happen to remember the YMM, or the member name? Just thought I might review that thread.

I carefully quizzed the customer and my service advisor, and they both encountered a crank no start, as opposed to a no crank. But that doesn't mean there can't be a starting system problem...

Have taken a fuel pump waveform?

Not yet. Maybe I'll rig that up today.

I honestly figured a dead segment would show up more frequently than this. But, weird stuff happens. :silly:

It was a 2018 Hyundai sonata. Titled "no start" by elmo

He had a push start system. And it would slow start then progressed to a no start. A quick way to rule out the starter for an issue since you have the tools is to put a amp clamp on the battery cable to starter and crank it. Looking for excessive noise or commutator issue. If your situation does not have slow start and cranks each time just doesnt start. I would start looking at a asd relay or ignition switch or a ground conection for cam sensor, coils or pcm.

Hey just looked at a 2010 fusion video and you may want to look at the injector harness and see what voltage your getting. Then the connector right above trans that has 4-5 wires on it check those wires for corrosion/ almost broken wires. One other possibilty is ect sensor. What is the one in the car reading?

Hardtopdr2 wrote: Hey just looked at a 2010 fusion video and you may want to look at the injector harness and see what voltage your getting. Then the connector right above trans that has 4-5 wires on it check those wires for corrosion/ almost broken wires. One other possibilty is ect sensor. What is the one in the car reading?

I'll check this morning and let you know.

These are the various thermistor temps prior to startup, after sitting overnight:



I don't have the captures available at the moment, but I also scoped injector and coil power voltage drop to B+. It was always within 500mV, usually much less.

I also scoped open circuit voltage across the battery during a clear flood crank. I don't have an amp probe on hand at the moment (day off), but with Peak Detect on, I can usually spot an open motor segment in the voltage waveform. There was none.

Here's a data capture from a test drive, if it helps at all:

www.scanshare.io/share/bhO79xS3D0WA_fBN1PwFww

Was your outside temps at time of data capture 82 degrees? +/- 5 degrees

Hardtopdr2 wrote: Was your outside temps at time of data capture 82 degrees? +/- 5 degrees

76 degrees, according to my phone. :silly:

Ok all sensor readings are normal then.
With the fpdm is it under the car or somewhere easy to get to?

Hardtopdr2 wrote: With the fpdm is it under the car or somewhere easy to get to?

Easy-ish? :lol: It's in the trunk, drivers side, behind a beauty/hush panel.

Scratch that check the tsb's for no start issues there is a software update/ problem with tcm eeprom failing. Check for other tsbs related and if software is up to date.

Tsb 390048

Ugg facepalm edit....
The tsb search changed it to a focus... #$%%# anyway might still be a possibility as i am not sure if they use the same pcm /tcm box just programmed for a fusion.

Tsb 326363 is another one thoigh this involves a red triangle on dash and a stop safely now message

Any luck?

Hardtopdr2 wrote: Any luck?

The stubborn SOB still starts! :silly:

I got even more aggressive with it over the weekend. Voltage dropped the coil power, and the injector power circuits. Always lovely.

I replicated the initial circumstances by refueling the vehicle, driving 10 miles, then parking it. Next morning, started right up.

I tried wrapping the key in foil just to see how it'd react to an anti theft problem. No crank, instead of a no start.

I re-re-re interrogated my service advisor. Crank no start.

May need to peek at fpdm for a near broken wire. And smell it for cooking electronics. Maybe even a wire tugging.

Had one the other week with a caddy ... with ps rear door open window and locks would not work.... close door they would work. Turned out to be a broken wire that would make contact when door closed.

Just came across a possibility does the focus use a fake distributor with a two bolt cam sensor? If it does probe it and see if it glitches when on a test drive doing wide open throttle snaps. if it does it might be the bushing in the fake distributor shaft having to much play. Its a long shot but doesnt take long to do.

Hardtopdr2 wrote: Just came across a possibility does the focus use a fake distributor with a two bolt cam sensor? If it does probe it and see if it glitches when on a test drive doing wide open throttle snaps. if it does it might be the bushing in the fake distributor shaft having to much play. Its a long shot but doesnt take long to do.

I believe you're thinking of the old Vulcan 3.0's in the Taurus/Sable, right?

There's no dummy plug/cam synchronizer on this one. Two CMP sensors and one CKP sensor. The VVT system has always performed correctly on test drives.

Possibly i will keep an eye out see what else it could be.