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2009 Dodge Ram 3500 6.7 Diesel Cummins Automatic No Start, ECM No Communication

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14 Nov 2017 00:54 - 16 Nov 2017 03:37 #14860 by Prorad11
Hello to everyone, I am new to this forum and beginner fixing and diagnostics cars working hard to improve my skills and knowledge.
I have a customer complaining about no start, Stall on the hwy, turn the key off and On again no lights no start nothing completely dead.

Tow the truck to the Diesel Shop, sit there for a week and end up with: that they don't know what is wrong with the truck.

Tow the truck to my garage.

Work begins:

-Check the battery, completely dead, slow charge over the night, battery ok!

-Turn key ON, lights came on, gauges and lights pre-test pass, notice... ! that the mileage was showing but no shifting selection for the transmission was showing, first think it came up in my mind: no communication of TCM (Transmission Control Module) with BCM,IPM,TIMP,FCM(Body Control Module, Integrated Power Module, Total Integrated Module, Front Control Module) all of them they call it different or with cluster.

-Check the codes for the first time. Tool used: Lunch x431 Pro

4 Modules Have Codes. 10 Codes Total. All of them Lost Communication with modules ABS, TCM, ECM,BCM(IPM,FCM,TIPM) or Battery LOW or HIGH Voltage U0101,U0100,B210E,B210D,B2213,U0141.
Check Detailed list, the PDF file Attached Below "Diagnostic Report"

Notice that the fuse 30, 15A for ABS Module missing
Instal new fuse.

-Erased the codes and Quick Scan again:

2 Modules have codes: 5 Codes Total
ABS-Module
C2206 Vehicle Configuration Mismatch
C2202 Original VIN Mismatch/Missing
U0100 Lost Communication With ECM/PCM
U0141 Lost Communication With IPM(FCM/TIPM)

BCM-Module
U0100 Lost Communication With ECM/PCM

Diagnostics Begins:
ABS-Module
Tool used: Incandescent Test light
-Check for power ABS-Module Harness Side Pin. 32,31,2
Power O.k.
-Check for Ground ABS-Module Harness Side pin 16,45
Ground O.K.
A tool used Digital Multimeter.
-Check for voltage pin3 CanC+ ABS harness side
~2.6V I do not remember exact voltage I believe 2.57V
-Check for voltage pin18 CanC- ABS harness side
~2.5V I do not -//- -//- I believe 2.46V
-Check for resistance circuit D65 CanC+, between Pin1-3 (TIMP Connector C6 Brown Color-ABS) and between Pin 9-18 (TIMP Connector C6 Brawn -ABS)
no resistance.

ECM-Module
-Check for reference or 5V at any ECM Outputs I chose crankshaft sensor Pin 1 since I was under the truck.
5V Present meaning the ECM is getting power and ground but anyway I checked ECM for power and ground.
-Check for powers Connector C2 Pin.49,50,60 ECM
Power O.K.
-Check for Grounds ECM Connector C2 Pin.47,48,57
Ground O.K.

-Check for resistance circuit D65 and D64 Bettwen TIMP-ECM C6-C2 Pin.1-1 and 9-21
No Resistance
-Check for voltage
ECM C2
CanC+ Pin. 1 ~2.6 V
CanC- Pin. 21 ~2.5V


Tool Used Snap On Vantage PRO

Also, I run graphing voltage meter for Circuit D65, D64 and D51, D52
D64 Bettwen TIMP C6 Pin 9 and ECM C2 Pin 21
Graphs was exactly the same for each side of circuit
D65 TIMP-ECM C6-C2 Pin 1-1
Graphs was exactly the same for each side of circuit

No picture yet I will try to upload tomorrow

Also, I check the CanC- but different circuits.
TIMP C6 Pin 9 and DLC (Data link connector) Pin 14
Completely different graphs.
And a lot of noise on Pin 14 side

No picture yet

Tool used Lunch X431 Pro.
I looked for live data in Transsmision module i was able to see the possion of the shifter battery vltage and so on.
I tried for ECM nothing was showing no battery voltage no water temperture etc.

Questions:
1) When I did graphs voltage meter for the CanC- different circuits am I suppose to have the same graphs?
2) How to check TIMP module.
3) Do I have bad ECM or TIMP or somethings else.

Thank you in advance.
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Last edit: 16 Nov 2017 03:37 by Prorad11.
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14 Nov 2017 20:41 - 14 Nov 2017 20:42 #14884 by Chad
Oh, boy! You've got a good one! Loss of communication problems can be a pain in the @ss, all by themselves. The fact that someone else was there before you adds an EXTRA element of unknown.

I offer this for anyone that wants to input:


"Knowledge is a weapon. Arm yourself, well, before going to do battle."
"Understanding a question is half an answer."
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Last edit: 14 Nov 2017 20:42 by Chad.
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14 Nov 2017 20:50 - 14 Nov 2017 20:51 #14886 by Chad
Info attached.

"Knowledge is a weapon. Arm yourself, well, before going to do battle."
"Understanding a question is half an answer."
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Last edit: 14 Nov 2017 20:51 by Chad.
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15 Nov 2017 15:00 #14900 by Prorad11
Thanks for you Help!
I still confused about couple things if you could take a look at those attachments and help me to figure it out.
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15 Nov 2017 19:48 #14902 by Chad
C2202

"Knowledge is a weapon. Arm yourself, well, before going to do battle."
"Understanding a question is half an answer."
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15 Nov 2017 19:58 #14904 by Tyler
Ah yeah, gotta love it when someone else has had their hands all over a vehicle before you. :silly:

I'd argue that your TIPM is OK as far as network communication, as we know that the Diagnostic CAN C works (because you can get codes), and that you can talk to other modules on the CAN C bus. You could try communicating with the TCM for scan data to confirm this.

That 'Network Diagnostic' function is gonna be something specific to the WiTech factory scanner, so don't sweat that. ;-) The way to tell if the PCM is active on the bus is to try to communicate with it directly. If you can't get codes or scan data out of it, then it's not active on the bus.

I know that you checked for a 5V reference, but would you be willing to try something? Disconnect the fan clutch, near the left headlight, and recheck for communication with the ECM. It's very common for the speed sensor within the clutch to short and pull the ECM down with it. If that doesn't work, thanks for indulging me! :cheer:
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15 Nov 2017 19:58 #14905 by Chad
I assume, "Logged Against" is referring to control modules that are "complaining about". For example, you ABS module has set a U0100. Also, your BCM has set a U0100. Or, possibly, it could be referring to other modules that are requesting the MIL light to be illuminated.

I'm, really, not sure.

"Knowledge is a weapon. Arm yourself, well, before going to do battle."
"Understanding a question is half an answer."
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08 Oct 2019 23:36 #34091 by bukva_j
Hey guys, I know it's an old post but was wondering if this ever got resolved. I have the exact issue and codes.

ECM has battery voltage at all 3 batt+ wires and batt voltage on ignition wire. All 3 grounds are good too. Can C at ECM is 2.4v/2.6v respectively and with 60ohm resistance at key off on them back probed as the ECM has one of the termination resistor built in. ECM is not supplying ground to ASD relay. No comm with ECM.

When I go into data stream in ECM I get no data for any sensor.

I'm stumped. Just don't want to throw parts at it without being sure it's the ECM.
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17 Oct 2019 15:19 #34350 by bukva_j
Update. So I finally pulled the trigger on a used ECM from a salvage yard. Installed the ECM and edited the VIN and transferred the security code via the immobilizer module ( skim/skreem). Truck fired right up. While waiting on the module to get delivered I finally found what I was experiencing. Here is the link.

The guy in the vid reflashed the software where as I swapped modules. Result is the same. I am also using a Launch scan tool.
Hope this helps someone out.
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28 Nov 2019 17:22 #35414 by PhilR
I've been following this thread with interest as I have been dealing with a 2007.5 Ram with the 6.7 Cummins that also had a no start, no crank issue and without communication to the PCM. Long story but I also replaced the PCM to get the truck running. I was curious if you could step through how you used the Launch scan tool for transferring the secret code to the PCM you replaced. I've got a P0633 "SKIM secret key not programmed in PCM) that I was hoping to get rid of. Thanks!
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01 Dec 2019 13:01 #35480 by bukva_j
To transfer the security pin code, you actually need to know the code. Once pin is inputted you will be able to transfer security info to ECM. I forget which has the option under special functions/options section. It should be either WCM, TIPM(BCM), or Skim-Skreem.

The pin you can get at dealer which is free but you would need to show proof of ownership or have the owner get it.

Another option is to use Chrysler pin puller from Google play store on your device with an ELM327 adapter. It is a token based app though.


play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=co..._jXYnMJoLasQWDk7rQBg
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01 Dec 2019 16:03 #35485 by PhilR
Thanks for the reply. This truck happens to be my own so no problem with going the dealer route and showing ownership documents. However, I hadn't heard of the Pin Puller app and pretty interested so will try that as long as the credits aren't too costly.
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02 Dec 2019 10:52 #35516 by bukva_j
PhilR,

Tokens are $5 for 10 tokens. I believe they give you some upfront also to get you started. Transferring IMMO info is pretty simple. It's in one of the modules I mentioned under special functions. Let me know how it goes for you.

Denis
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17 Dec 2019 12:44 #35882 by PhilR
So the Pin Puller app worked great and it actually came with just enough tokens to do the job for free!

On to the actual secret code writing to the ECM it's not as clearly spelled out with the Launch tool. In the SKIM/WCM module there is a special function that's called "ECM/PCM replaced" or something to that effect. Selecting it comes with some dire warnings so I did not proceed. Can you confirm this is the function you used for writing the secret code and that is all it does? Currently the ECM has the correct vin and is working OK so a little paranoid about taking a step backwards. Thanks!
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27 Dec 2019 23:01 - 27 Dec 2019 23:09 #36179 by bukva_j
I don't remember exactly and have no vehicle to check the exact steps but it sounds correct. When you go further It'll ask you to enter the correct pin. Then it'll prompt you to continue to transfer security info. I remember being nervous too but all was fine. The warnings are there so that if you don't know why you are in that menu then you probably shouldn't be there. It doesn't change any coding just transfers security/immobilizer info. Hope this helps. Let me know if u have any other questions.
Last edit: 27 Dec 2019 23:09 by bukva_j. Reason: Needed to add more info.
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25 May 2020 12:40 #40184 by Chbaird94
I see this is an old thread but I’m fighting the same battle with the same year truck. However , my crank no start issue has been intermittent. It has shut off on me about 4 times. Days sometimes weeks apart. But will start back up after a little while. Except this last time it shut off it won’t start again. Does this sound like the ecm taking a dump or a shirt somewhere making the ecm freak out then eventually frying it?
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28 May 2020 02:56 #40239 by Andy.MacFadyen
It might be better if you stsrted a new thread for your issue.

" We're trying to plug a hole in the universe, what are you doing ?. "
(Walter Bishop Fringe TV show)



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